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Originally Posted by TrunKated
Not with thre crippling costs of food and energy now. We went from a surplus to debt. People are being crushed by job loss, high costs, and expensive credit. I feel the pain every day, and I have a pretty good job.
Must be nice to be independently wealthy, like you, dude.
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Unless he/she has already stated that he or she is wealthy, thats quite a speculation. And Gender hazzard said that times are tough, its just not caused by the war. Credit and jobloss have nothing to do with the war. And dont say that im not hurting, because i just went four weeks with no work and drive 50 miles to my school.
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Originally Posted by TrunKated
Again, I think most people on earth except warmongers would agree war is not justifiable except as direct self defense. Do you beat people up in bars because they look at you funny, dude? Are you that type? Do you decide that your neighbor is hiding a shotgun so you break into his house and kill his pets and maybe his brother? I really don't understand your violent attitude?
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Thats not entirely fair. Iraq didnt look funny at someone, and hiding a shot gun in your house is legal. We had evidence, confirmed by MI6 MI5 and other intelligence agencies by the way, that they had WMDs. If you think thats a forgery, thats speculation, but speculation is fine. Maybe your right, and it was forged and they somehow had the ability to pay off those agencies. But the UN never said 'you cant investigate this is a forgery' which is a legitimate reason to say no, they just said. 'oh thats nice. No.'
And Hussain isnt just your neighbor, hes more like your neighbor with six attempts at murdering his neighbors with a shotgun (His previous attempts to invade other countries). Now you susspect he has a shotgun(WMD). What do you do? call the police. Who was supposed to police this guy? the UN. And we went to them saying 'we think he has this here. can you check for us?' and they said no.
Does this mean we break into the house to take this guy out first? Ill admit, im not entirely sold on that, but if your neighbor had six attempted murders, you call the cops you saw that he has a new gun that hes not supposed to have and they dont give a damn, what DO you do? The problem with your self defence only policy means that you wait until people are killed before you do anything.
Though i will state again i was not for the war and that there should have been other steps taken, i think the very poor handling from the UN is as much to blame as anyone else for us having to invade.
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Originally Posted by TrunKated
No, I am just trying to understand why people support death and destruction. I really don't get it. Sure, it's fine in defense. Someone threatens me or my family and I'm there! But a pre-emptive war? How about I decide the guy on the next block might some day steal my bike? Should I fake evidence and then kill him?
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Again, he wasnt stealing bikes, he was killing people. And if you think someone is going to steal your bike, you go to the police... you know how this goes now.
And 'If someone threatens my family and im there' Is that only for your family? what if your around when someone is pointing a gun at a random person on the street, do you not care because it wasnt your family? He was killing people, but it wasnt Americans at the moment so we should have ignored it?
And also, Hussain has threatened the Bush family and tried to kill them before, so according to you he has just cause....
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Originally Posted by loliknowrite
oh, a good old political showdown. let me slaughter all your sacred cows. the war was wring, obama is in the pocket of corporate interests, people are dying each day thanks to bush, the middle east is justified in their hatred of us, McCain is a puppet figurehead, the Jerry Falwell/billy graham crowd controls over half of american through religious brainwashing and self destructive Armageddon focused campaigns of fear and bigotry, your elected officials don't give a flying fuck about you, unless you hold some money over their heads. people are petty, vicious and irredeemable, god is dead, the universe is dying, compassion has killed evolution and science has doomed us all.
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Other than the Middle east is justified thing ( because their hatred is not from the war and regaurdless of that should not hate everyone in a nation for what they feel a few indiduals are doing to them, thats like hating all *insert race or religous group here* because one person from that group beat you up and took your lunch money. DAMN YOU BIFF!) I have to agree with your post, and ask for permission to use it in any political debate i enter into. it sums things up rather nicely.... Quick and to the point.