Mary Jane Meets The Moon Sequence

[vincent_richter]

Originally Posted by hexen

Too much trust goes into those comissions, being as paranoid as I am it would take long to trust an artist that I only see online enough to comission something. I certainly understand FullMoonMaster's issues, but I can't stop wishing that Ranzab will show up somehow and finish the job...

I'm going to assume some things here, so forgive me if I'm way off-base, but here goes nothing.

FullMoonMaster has every right to be upset here.
Ranzab took the money, and - assuming that each commission was independently funded on a completion basis - failed to deliver the paid-for product.
He failed to deliver even a HINT of the paid-for product.
That's NOT a simple "I wish to disappear" situation. That's called FRAUD. It is A CRIME.
I get pissed on an awful lot for not always jumping to the defense of these forums' rules, but this is not that.
These are real laws, agreed upon by the whole of modern society, which are being flouted for personal financial gain. Whatever the end result - be it for good or ill - Ranzab's means are wholly illegal.

Now, that being said, I suppose we should be grateful that he didn't just shit out a couple random doodles and call it "done." That'd be arguably MORE dishonest, and grounds for a civil suit, which would make him more of a potential liability than any criminal charge ever could.

[Shadow_Dragon]

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

I'm going to assume some things here, so forgive me if I'm way off-base, but here goes nothing.

FullMoonMaster has every right to be upset here.
Ranzab took the money, and - assuming that each commission was independently funded on a completion basis - failed to deliver the paid-for product.
He failed to deliver even a HINT of the paid-for product.
That's NOT a simple "I wish to disappear" situation. That's called FRAUD. It is A CRIME.
I get pissed on an awful lot for not always jumping to the defense of these forums' rules, but this is not that.
These are real laws, agreed upon by the whole of modern society, which are being flouted for personal financial gain. Whatever the end result - be it for good or ill - Ranzab's means are wholly illegal.

Now, that being said, I suppose we should be grateful that he didn't just shit out a couple random doodles and call it "done." That'd be arguably MORE dishonest, and grounds for a civil suit, which would make him more of a potential liability than any criminal charge ever could.

Again ill reinstate my reference to the whole pilot scenario. Also, considering the fact that nolaf openly stated his leaving the community and his reasons, I can only surmise that Ranzab befell a similar, if not, much more grim situation.

While it is completely wrong of him to have abandoned the community completely without a trace, I believe we should also observe this issue with a speculative appeal.

[vincent_richter]

]EDIT[

Originally Posted by TF-Viewer

What do you mean 'failed to deliver even a hint of the paid for product'? We can clearly see he completed at least 5 full pages of it. That's well more than a hint.

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

Ranzab took the money, and - assuming that each commission was independently funded on a completion basis - failed to deliver the paid-for product.

I call out the relevant portion there. Substantial completion "of the whole" is irrelevant if each piece was independently commissioned.
This is a well-known aspect of contract law, and isn't really a battle worth fighting; after all, define "the whole" in this scenario. If the pieces were individually commissioned, there's no way of knowing or proving that definition.

Originally Posted by TF-Viewer

Apparently no one has heard from Ranzab in 2 years, he may not even be alive at this point. How about you hold off on the accusations of fraud until you can prove the guy didn't just die unexpectedly years ago?

I'd love to assume the worst, because it makes what he did excusable. It's cold and it's heartless, but it's also the truth. Right now, I'm siding with Occam's Razor; that being, that the number of scam artists jacking people's cash for their own slight gain, far outnumbers the number of artists vanishing from the Internet due to whatever physical ailment they suffer. I'm also siding with onus probandi, which will be the FIRST thing established at any trial. Again, cold and heartless. That's our legal system, to a "T".

Of course, if something untoward DID happen to Raznab, I'd feel terrible about these posts, and wish that evidence were brought to light sooner. Discovery's a real bitch, sometimes. That being said, I cannot assume that he's dead, either; that makes it too easy to write off a potential wrong.
]/EDIT[

Originally Posted by x†xShadow_Dragonx†x

Again ill reinstate my reference to the whole pilot scenario. Also, considering the fact that nolaf openly stated his leaving the community and his reasons, I can only surmise that Tanzania befell a similar, if not, much more grim situation.

While it is completely wrong of him to have abandoned the community completely without a trace, I believe we should also observe this issue with a speculative appeal.

Do me a HUGE favor here. Don't defend him on that one point. Refunding the payment is a simple matter.

I'm all for an artist packing his bags whenever he's tired, or scared, or progressing, or whatever reason they want to give.
Jacking the cash and refusing delivery IS NOT the same thing.
I'll say it again, because it bears repeating. It is FRAUD. It is A CRIME. It hurts REAL. FUCKING. PEOPLE.

If you're really onboard with someone taking the money and running, I'd like to let you know that I'd be happy to sell you a Lamborghini for $100, payable immediately to my PayPal account, sight unseen.

[TF-Viewer]

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

If the pieces were individually commissioned

You based your whole argument on that one point. You've made a series of huge assumptions. You assume they were individually commissioned, you assume he's committed fraud, you also assume that the letter of the law regarding fraud is the same everywhere. You aren't even considering the difference in state laws in conjunction with federal law. Contract law is not universal, it can vary from place to place and that has to be taken into account when transactions take place across state lines or between people residing in different countries.

So really.. assumption assumption assumption on your part mixed in with a fair amount of anger (unless I'm misreading the shouting portions) that's probably misdirected. I'll remind you that you do not know any of the details surrounding this situation aside from the fact that the commission was paid for and not completed. You've made gigantic assumptions based on limited information that portrays events in a way that makes things appear far worse than they may actually be.

He may be dead. He may have suffered injuries to his drawing hand. There are countless possible reasons why this happened, yet you admittedly assume foul play without evidence to support that. That's not cool. Give him the benefit of the doubt until you have an actual credible bit of information that supports your claim of fraud.

[Esquire]

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

...Right now, I'm siding with Occam's Razor; that being, that the number of scam artists jacking people's cash for their own slight gain, far outnumbers the number of artists vanishing from the Internet due to whatever physical ailment they suffer. ...

Hanlon's Razor would contradict that, but Occam trumps Hanlon.

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

I would also like to point out that there seem to be a number of artists deadset on producing as much "nightmare fuel" as is humanly possible. Is the new definition of "edgy" anything to do with shitting dicknipples?

I would never get close to that sort of thing, and my whole shtick is turning TFs into nightmare fuel.

As for the identification issues, I've run headlong into those, since I don't want to risk either of my very, very vital Paypal accounts in order to get paid for commissions, and all the alternatives are limited. Both emails, entirely by coincidence, bring up my real name on Google. Lovely. If anyone has any anonymous alternatives to Paypal for someone outside of the US, please PM me.

There's an artist I knew of who abruptly took down all his TF Work. It wasn't until a while later that I suddenly realized I had been following his civvie work, so to speak, for a while, and he had linked his TF work to his personal work. Even today, I can still find scraps. Shame, really. His TF work was quite good, especially that one Catwoman in a spiked collar pic...

[Shadow_Dragon]

Originally Posted by Esquire

There's an artist I knew of who abruptly took down all his TF Work. It wasn't until a while later that I suddenly realized I had been following his civvie work, so to speak, for a while, and he had linked his TF work to his personal work. Even today, I can still find scraps. Shame, really. His TF work was quite good, especially that one Catwoman in a spiked collar pic...

I know whom you speak of and it is quite disappointing and sad that such a situation was wrought upon him.

[TF-Viewer]

Originally Posted by vincent_richter

I'm going to assume some things here, so forgive me if I'm way off-base, but here goes nothing.

FullMoonMaster has every right to be upset here.
Ranzab took the money, and - assuming that each commission was independently funded on a completion basis - failed to deliver the paid-for product.
He failed to deliver even a HINT of the paid-for product.
That's NOT a simple "I wish to disappear" situation. That's called FRAUD. It is A CRIME.
I get pissed on an awful lot for not always jumping to the defense of these forums' rules, but this is not that.
These are real laws, agreed upon by the whole of modern society, which are being flouted for personal financial gain. Whatever the end result - be it for good or ill - Ranzab's means are wholly illegal.

Now, that being said, I suppose we should be grateful that he didn't just shit out a couple random doodles and call it "done." That'd be arguably MORE dishonest, and grounds for a civil suit, which would make him more of a potential liability than any criminal charge ever could.

What do you mean 'failed to deliver even a hint of the paid for product'? We can clearly see he completed at least 5 full pages of it. That's well more than a hint. Apparently no one has heard from Ranzab in 2 years, he may not even be alive at this point. How about you hold off on the accusations of fraud until you can prove the guy didn't just die unexpectedly years ago?